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www.tolkien.rs • Pogledaj temu - Tocak vremena ili Pesme leda i vatre?

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Postod Blah u Ned Mar 28, 2004 10:50 pm

If and when and might be.
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Član
Član
 
Postovi: 303
Pridružio se: Ned Mar 14, 2004 7:06 am

 

Postod Dragonlord u Ned Mar 28, 2004 11:05 pm

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Član
Član
 
Postovi: 499
Pridružio se: Ned Maj 18, 2003 2:06 pm

 

Postod Eladan u Pon Mar 29, 2004 12:00 pm

...To stand against the Shadow so long as iron is hard and stone abides. To defend the weak while one drop of blood remains. To avenge what cannot be defended...
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Ukleti Princ-lutalica
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Postovi: 12100
Pridružio se: Pet Jul 12, 2002 7:16 am
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Postod Aragorn u Pon Mar 29, 2004 1:12 pm

I ZENE PRDE !!!!
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Postovi: 725
Pridružio se: Ned Jul 08, 2001 5:46 pm
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Postod Niena u Pon Mar 29, 2004 7:58 pm

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Postovi: 1411
Pridružio se: Ned Jan 12, 2003 2:47 pm
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Postod Finglofin u Pon Mar 29, 2004 9:49 pm

Kako za koga. Ja se time bavim i to proucavam, meni to nije dosadno, ali s obzirom da vidim da niste bas raspolozeni za neku vecu diskusiju, prebaci cu se na vasu duzinu :). Slazem se sa konstatacijom da je Martin dinamicniji, ali je previse prost i povrsan ( jako je slican latinoamerickim sapunicama, puno zapleta, a malo vrednih stvari). Nemoj te me pogresno shvatiti, nije da se meni Martin ne svidja, vec naprosto ne mogu tako povrsno da ocenjujem knjige, sorry.
Dobio sam obavestenje od Dejana Papica (iz Lagune) da ce zmaj izaci krajem aprila, a oluja maceva za cetiri meseca. Mislim da je bio iskren, jer sam mu zapretio smrcu u pismu, ako me opet bude slagao :).
Stade sve, samo zivot prodje,
Sine, moj, oci njene plave,
Doso dan da u vojsku podjes,
Lumpuju usijane glave,
Sine moj,kako da te pustim,
Ti si sve sto mi od nje osta,
Di ces stim trepuskama gustim,
Zivot bas i ne zna sta je dosta,e

Djordje Balasevic: Regruterska
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Član
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Postovi: 200
Pridružio se: Ned Feb 29, 2004 12:16 pm
Lokacija: Beograd

 

Postod Dragonlord u Pon Mar 29, 2004 10:06 pm

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Član
Član
 
Postovi: 499
Pridružio se: Ned Maj 18, 2003 2:06 pm

 

Postod Maya u Uto Mar 30, 2004 7:34 pm

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Postovi: 938
Pridružio se: Sub Nov 09, 2002 9:20 pm
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Postod Finglofin u Sre Mar 31, 2004 8:10 am

Stade sve, samo zivot prodje,
Sine, moj, oci njene plave,
Doso dan da u vojsku podjes,
Lumpuju usijane glave,
Sine moj,kako da te pustim,
Ti si sve sto mi od nje osta,
Di ces stim trepuskama gustim,
Zivot bas i ne zna sta je dosta,e

Djordje Balasevic: Regruterska
Korisnikov avatar
Član
Član
 
Postovi: 200
Pridružio se: Ned Feb 29, 2004 12:16 pm
Lokacija: Beograd

 

Postod Blah u Čet Apr 01, 2004 1:13 pm

If and when and might be.
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Član
Član
 
Postovi: 303
Pridružio se: Ned Mar 14, 2004 7:06 am

 

Postod Finglofin u Čet Apr 01, 2004 10:31 pm

Stade sve, samo zivot prodje,
Sine, moj, oci njene plave,
Doso dan da u vojsku podjes,
Lumpuju usijane glave,
Sine moj,kako da te pustim,
Ti si sve sto mi od nje osta,
Di ces stim trepuskama gustim,
Zivot bas i ne zna sta je dosta,e

Djordje Balasevic: Regruterska
Korisnikov avatar
Član
Član
 
Postovi: 200
Pridružio se: Ned Feb 29, 2004 12:16 pm
Lokacija: Beograd

 

Postod Blah u Pet Apr 02, 2004 12:31 am

If and when and might be.
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Član
Član
 
Postovi: 303
Pridružio se: Ned Mar 14, 2004 7:06 am

 

Postod Eladan u Pet Apr 02, 2004 8:28 am

Definitivno Martinov zaplet doživljavam kao bolji i realniji, i nemam šta da dodam izuzetno preciznoj analizi koju je Blah napravila
...To stand against the Shadow so long as iron is hard and stone abides. To defend the weak while one drop of blood remains. To avenge what cannot be defended...
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Ukleti Princ-lutalica
Ukleti Princ-lutalica
 
Postovi: 12100
Pridružio se: Pet Jul 12, 2002 7:16 am
Lokacija: Na radu u Minas Tiritu

 

Postod Finglofin u Pet Apr 02, 2004 6:48 pm

Mislim da nisi upravu kada kazes da je zaplet Martina uverljiviji. Pre svega, nisi svoje tvrdjenje argumentovala.
Zaplet Dzordana je uverljiviji jer je ( po stoti put se ponavljam :) ) dublji i dugovecniji, odnosno stvari nisu onakve kakvim se cine. Kod Martina je drugacije, jer je sve determinisano samim likovim, i cela njegova fabula zasnovana na liku pada u vodu ukoluko lika eliminise ( priznaces, prilicno glupo), sto je slucaja sa Nedom.
Dalje, sigurno neces reci da je kod Martina atmosfera, jako raznolika. Ma, hajde, pa, uvek je sve oko rata ili ljubavi ( sto je i slucaj sa Dzordanom, ali kao sto sam vec rekao amosfera je kompleksnija u WOT- u) i Martinova amosfera pada u vodu ukoluko je akter nezanimljiv.
Sustina moje price je u sledecem: Martin budi kratkotrajne i jake emocije, ali prozaicne bez prave vrednosti, dok Dzordan detaljnim i istancanim obradjivanjem teme i likova uspeva da stvori jedan trajan svet sa pravim sistemom vrednosti.

I jos nesto. Sadasnji svet je veoma slican Martinovom (puno intriga, spletki, malodusnosti, otrcanosti...). Dzordan stvara iluziju sveta kakav je mogao biti, odnosno jasna razlika izmedju dobra i zla (ah, kako bi lepo bilo da mogu u startu znati ko je ko :) )
Stade sve, samo zivot prodje,
Sine, moj, oci njene plave,
Doso dan da u vojsku podjes,
Lumpuju usijane glave,
Sine moj,kako da te pustim,
Ti si sve sto mi od nje osta,
Di ces stim trepuskama gustim,
Zivot bas i ne zna sta je dosta,e

Djordje Balasevic: Regruterska
Korisnikov avatar
Član
Član
 
Postovi: 200
Pridružio se: Ned Feb 29, 2004 12:16 pm
Lokacija: Beograd

 

Postod Finglofin u Pet Apr 02, 2004 6:53 pm

Martin definitivno ima talenta, ali to je sve. Pazljivim proucavanjem WOT-a dolazi se do gomile arhetipskih motiva (kolektivno nesvesno) i Dzordan se moze tumaciti iz velikog broja aspekata.
Rekao bih jos samo da je Martin nesto sto se u ovom svetu zove linija lakseg otpora, dok je Dzordan a long way journy. Ko razume shvatice, na sta sam mislio :).
Stade sve, samo zivot prodje,
Sine, moj, oci njene plave,
Doso dan da u vojsku podjes,
Lumpuju usijane glave,
Sine moj,kako da te pustim,
Ti si sve sto mi od nje osta,
Di ces stim trepuskama gustim,
Zivot bas i ne zna sta je dosta,e

Djordje Balasevic: Regruterska
Korisnikov avatar
Član
Član
 
Postovi: 200
Pridružio se: Ned Feb 29, 2004 12:16 pm
Lokacija: Beograd

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